China Travel 2.0

I found twitter always can brings great persons, their tweets can give you inspiration and let you understand the world more and deeply.  Her tweets about Chinese culture and knowlodge about Chinese Medicine and the good heart always let me to know her more, from the first day when I met Debra Xiangjun via twitter, I can feel her warm-hearted, she is a good person to meet. She has a beautiful Chinese name-湘君, please follow this interview to know her.

1. Please tell us your name and your job, and where are you from.

My name is Debra Hayes. Most people know me as Debra or Debra Xiangjun. I am a multi-ethnic healer, global health researcher, writer and professor, specializing in culture and medicine, comparative medicine, traditional and indigenous medicine, practicing applied anthropology and medical anthropology. I’m also working toward my Chinese Medicine Doctorate. I was born in Chicago, Illinois but consider Huaihua, Hunan china home.

Do you have a Chinese name? Yes, 杜湘君。

How did it come to you and what does it mean?

I waited almost nine years for my Chinese name. Long story short, after I found Chinese medicine, studied it for three years and then found the masters from China who welcomed me, invited my inquiry and study, everyone within the circle of healers and the herbal shops thought I should have a Chinese name but no one could agree upon whom should give it to me. A few years later, after I began studying Chinese culture, language and philosophy, and met my Chinese teacher, Wu laoshi, whom I affectionately call my “Chinese mother,” I still didn’t have one. She didn’t think it was her place to give me a Chinese name either. Rather, she thought my Chinese medicine masters should be the ones who conferred it. It was real Confucian circle! So when I came to China to live, study, research and teach in china the first time, I didn’t have a Chinese name. No one could believe it! After living and working in the international Chinese medicine hospital as part of a traditional workgroup, literally living a Chinese life through immersion and shared responsibility, my masters, friends, and students，decided on a Chinese name. They chose 杜湘君. As they told me and 付永 explained, they chose:

杜(Du) because it is a prominent Chinese family and it appears in many old Chinese traditional films and also because they think it sounds pleasing. 湘 (Xiang) because it is short for Hunan province and because it appeared in Chinese mythology. A faithful queen in ancient Hunan province was crying all day along because she was missing the king who died for the country. It is said that the bamboo was tingled with some of her tears and that even today you can see some spots on every Chinese bamboo, reminding us of the queen’s tears and her love for the king. Since Xiang (湘) has the same sound with “相”（xiang） “相,” it usually goes with a word “思” (si)。“相思”or“乡思”means “missing”. Essentially, it means I am missing my Chinese home, Huaihua, my Chinese mother and friends, and Chinese culture, tradition and medicine whenever I am away. (It’s true! I cry every time I leave China.)君 (jun) for two reasons. First, because it usually goes with a word zi (子); together junzi (君子) expresses the quality of a good Chinese scholar, who wouldn’t be corrupted by the dirty air of the society no matter what happens. (They think it is proper to my identity and personality.) Second because jun added to a woman’s name, is symbolic of“王昭君,”the most graceful and pretty woman in ancient China. At first she was ignored by the king”汉武帝” because the artist drew 昭君 ugly on purpose because he did not receive any money for this incomparable beauty. But 昭君 was very clever, when she got the chance. The northern Mongolian king asked for a wife from the Han Dynasty threatening he would launch a war, if China did not provide him with one. At that time, however, not even a single female slave was willing to be Mongolian king’s wife because Mongolia is too cold and far from home. One may not return for a lifetime. Nevertheless, 昭君 wrote a letter to 汉武帝 and told him she would go to the northern country and make contribution to Han Dynasty. She was permitted. However, on the day that the Mongolian king came to fetch his Chinese wife, 昭君 appeared at the palace of Han Dynasty for the first time. She was so pure, so young, that she was like a pink peach in spring. 汉武帝 was shocked at the fact that the portrait artist had cheated him. He killed the portrait artist and insisted that he wanted to possess 昭君 instead. 昭君 insisted that if 汉武帝 didn’t let her go with the Mongolian king, she would commit suicide. 汉武帝 had to permit this marriage. 昭君 brought much advanced techniques to the north and the peace between two countries lasted centuries.

As you can see, my name was worth the wait. I am very honored and obliged to live up to it. More importantly, perhaps, through living the experience within a traditional workgroup of Chinese medicine doctors, bonding as family members, I learned how to live up to this obligation, to extend healing to those who seek it, no matter where they are. My professors, Dr. Yan Zao Ming, Dr. Chu Chang Bing, Dr. Yang Qing Zhi and Dr. Zhang Xiukui and so many others taught me those things. Then again, Dr. Qiu Shao lin, my Chinese brother also served invaluable in this regard.

Why do you research the Chinese medicine?

Yuanfen (缘分！ I really don’t have any other words to explain it. About eleven years ago, I was literally on my deathbed, jaundiced, staving off kidney failure, running a high fever everyday, getting tired breathing. In fact, my skin and organs were becoming bone and I had to meditate at night to regulate my heart and breathing because they were not automatic. My kids were young. I only knew that I did not want to die then.

I had studied and used many medicines in my life and originally studied to be a surgeon, but became too ill to continue. It led me to retrace steps taken in my life, to step beyond the path of convention and see through “native eyes.” Since I had become allergic to all western medicine and it had only induced greater harm, I knew the answer had to be somewhere within other medicines. I had already used herbs from the Cherokee and the Sioux to sustain my life until then. Obviously, I hadn’t found the right one. Then, one day in my room, I found a book on Chinese medicine, written the year I was born. I couldn’t put it down! I used some simple qi gong it described and immediately saw some results. Yet, I knew I needed more help. So I began calling and emailing Chinese medicine doctors, knowing that practice differed, but I didn’t know how or why. I did not understand.

Luckily, a Chinese medicine doctor returned my call. She had studied in Mongolia and China after she left western medicine I agreed to meet her two days later in Chicago even though I didn’t know how I would get there. Walking ten feet exhausted me! Yet, I found the strength to take the train to Chicago, a cab to her office and entered not knowing what to expect. After one acupuncture treatment, I was able to walk back to the train, one mile in fifteen minutes—coat open in early March in Chicago. After it saved my life, I rededicated my life for the benefit of others. I never want anyone to suffer.

Three years later, I walked into a Chinese teashop looking for herbs. Little did I know that they only spoke Chinese. Although I knew only names of formulas, the woman somehow made sense to me. She told me to go upstairs after 1pm the next day. When I returned, I met Dr. Guang “Gary” Xie who contended I was already an expert. 哪里哪里。I insisted I was far from expert. Obviously, I hadn’t fixed myself. Then again, lupus (红斑狼疮), multiple sclerosis, scleroderma and the other conditions I had together were not easy for anyone. He told me that doctors never fix themselves because they don’t see themselves as others do. Then, he insisted I had life magic. Not long after that, he introduced me to Dr. Zhengang Guo, a seventh generation traditional Chinese medicine doctor from a traditional Chinese medicine family, who also trained as an oncologist and orthopedic surgeon. Before I knew it, I was studying with him, attending his seminars and completely enchanted, reading unbelievable amounts of material and always applying new techniques. Little did I know where it would all lead or how far it would pull me in.
Yet the miracles I had seen, the simplicity of theory application and so much more called to me. Before I knew it, I was deep into Chinese language, culture and philosophy study and in the process of completing two more degrees I never planned on. Never could I have imagined that I would have studied in China, let alone lead my own research, meet Dr. Xie’s colleague, Dr. Wang Hong Cai the Deputy Chief at the WHO Centre in Beijing for the study of Chinese medicine and so much more. I have really had such wonderful masters including Chinese medicine doctors who served so many people during the Cultural Revolution, an extremely gifted Chinese medicine and Qi gong doctor, Dr. Shu, who has such skill in herbs, acupuncture and medical qi gong, and my Chinese brother, Dr. Qiu Shao lin, who also performs acupotomy. However, I would be remiss if I did not express my profound and lasting gratitude to the Chinese people, to those who welcomed me into their homes, their hearts, their families and workgroups. To learn Chinese medicine you really have to live it. No matter how much study it requires, a lifetime, actually, the rewards are far more precious. I couldn’t have planned it if I tried. It has been an interesting journey- yuanfen.

Dr Shu and Dr. Yan

2 You have many websites in your facebook bio, which is your best one? (People can connect with me on Facebook, LinkedIn, or Twitter).

I will have a new one soon (I’m slowly working on it.) – www.healingworlds.org

Best bio is at: http://indigenous.pristine.net/events/2008/wsic/presentations/debra_hayes_en.html

Healingworlds.blogspot.com is merely personal reflection of healing and the global conversation about methods.

Lifebridges.blogspot.com is more about how we are each other’s life bridges.

You are an editor of http://www.topix.net/ , would you please tell us some info about the website ?

I am one of the editors for the China section on topix.net, which is essentially a place where editors post news stories and respond to comments and questions. Most of the editors merely moderate conversations and serve as supplemental sources of information. On the China section, we strive to offset many misconceptions.

I also serve as Coordinator for www.dailyappreciations.net

It is a site dedicated to uplifting people, sharing and expressing gratitude. It was founded by Dr. Dwan “Diane” Tai and Allies Building Community, Inc. www.archway2.org

3. East and west are quite different in many ways, the culture, the economy, the history, and the philosophy. Please tell us the image of China in your thought.

I think there are many aspects of China that foreigners find difficult to understand. After all, China has existed for thousands of years. One could study the language, history, culture, traditions and medicines for many lifetimes. Each is simple and complex, incredibly deep and intermixed and intermingled in many more ways and on many more levels than in the west. For example, one cannot study the medicine without learning about philosophy, intersecting traditions, history and different ways of seeing and knowing. One cannot merely study Dynastic cycles and their historic context without understanding the underpinning philosophy, the prevailing traditions and language, as well. It is all intricately interwoven. The levels of inquiry and investigation differ widely, as well. Yet, it is not impossible for foreigners to understand. Most people have to open their minds, read, ask questions, talk to people and/or study whichever aspect of Chinese culture interests them. It could be philosophy, Tai Chi, history, language, international relations—almost anything. All yield better insight.

My Chinese teacher, wu laoshi, emphasized the geography of China within her first China history courses for many reasons. China is large, divided by rivers and mountains. Given the geography, one can imagine how local traditions, languages and customs arose. People are rooted in very different ways than in the United States. As I was reminded through numerous dinner conversations in China and more poignantly through empty places at that table, many Chinese families, husbands and wives work in different provinces. If they’re lucky, they work in the same one. If they’re even more fortunate, they work where they were born. More often than not, especially within the south, one spouse works outside the province and the grandparents and the mother or father tend to the child. Is it any wonder that people cherish Chinese New Year and time with family, despite the hardships of Travel?

However, I must admit that living a Chinese life in a semi-closed village, sharing meals with families I met, becoming a part of a traditional workgroup inside and outside of the hospital, learning through interaction and through embracing connections really made me see so many things about life, about China and Chinese people. It made me understand the depth of connections, 关系，the meaning of participation 参加，connection to space and place, to one’s hometown, to the local food, the local language and the people on a much more personal level than I ever expected. In addition, addressing people, including strangers, as family members in accordance with age, such as older brother, aunt, etc., also distinguishes interaction and alternately serves as a mirror, for reflection and self-improvement. Because of all these experiences and the guanxi established, I more personally and poignantly understood the depths of Chinese people’s yearning for home, the importance of connections and relationships, Chinese New Year and time with family and friends. Indeed, there are so many aspects but connection pervades them all!

For Chinese people, I think it is hard to understand the differences in business, work and school relationships in the West. Whereas the heart sees in China, the mind sees in the west. Although the value of seeing through shen and utilizing so many tools engaged within Chinese medicine and its associative aspects are only now being understood in the west, business does not employ them. People rarely socialize outside of work, school, etc. Individualism is prized, but individualism also carries burdens. Society is just arranged differently. Public transportation is often not as convenient. So much is centered upon separateness.

Perhaps, the most crucial difference between east and west lies within worldview. The west tends to see the world as this OR that rather than this And that. Because of this, most of the western media and governments tend to classify world situations, people and governments as this or that. Not all people are their governments and/or hold these views, but most westerners are acculturated to see the world as black and white. Although China is a land of “both and,” reflecting Yin and Yang, westerners understand it in a very different way. After all, most westerners see yin and yang as merely opposites without the seeds of the other. They see it as merely hot or cold, dark or light. Accordingly, they fail to grasp how both yin and yang contain the seed of the other and their associative relationships. Even as I answer this, of course, my mind replays Dr. Wang Hong Cai explaining to his foreign medical students that yin and yang explains all things and that the macrocosm is in the microcosm. As in Chinese medicine, these elements also exist within Chinese culture and traditions. This is perhaps the most difficult concept for foreigners.

However, the world is changing. More people are becoming engaged in more social and global efforts for the benefit of others. More people are becoming familiar with people from other places and beginning to understand culture, history and traditions, even within business norms. This is a very good consequence of globalization. I truly believe that China and the west have a great deal to offer each other. They have been linked across time and alternately influenced each other in the past. They still do today, but I do think that China’s re-emergence on the world stage has reawakened the world to all that it has to offer.

5 What is the main difference between western medicine and Chinese medicine? Sometimes, Chinese medicine doesn’t work at all; what is your opinion?

There are many differences between Chinese and western medicine, but the central one is the approach. Western medicine actually suffers from reductionism, dismissing all other relevant influences, including diet, spirit, lifestyle, environment, geography, etc. It effectively treats a mere 25% of disease and does not successfully manage most conditions. Unlike Chinese medicine, most people take the same prescription for extended periods of time and then supplement those formulas with others. Most of them do not address the conditions, which gave rise to the illness itself. In a recent Institute of Medicine conference in Washington DC, it was explained as the patch and fix system.

Chinese medicine in many ways exemplifies molecular medicine. It engages different ways of seeing conditions, syndromes and explores how the condition arose. It is a holistic system that has extended from ancient times through today. Yet, the biggest difference between the two comes from Huang di Neijing detailing the three types of physicians. The best is exemplified as the one who prevents the syndrome, clearing an imbalance before it manifests as symptoms. The second type of physician is the one who prevents a syndrome from becoming a disease and eliminates the imbalance or deters it. The last and worst of these is one who treats a condition. Obviously, prevention is the key here.

Of the most obvious differences between the two are the methods of diagnostics. Although most Chinese medicine doctors in China can read all western medical test results and use them as a guide, the reverse is not true. So many low-tech methodologies could and should be more fully used in numerous contexts. Pulse diagnosis, coupled with constitution/genetic type and propensity for illness provide invaluable ways of knowing and seeing quickly. Moreover, Chinese medicine can be altered quickly to meet a person’s condition and need. Flexibility is key.

Admittedly, I have seen many miracles because of Chinese medicine and many due to surgical interventions of western medicine. Sometimes, Chinese medicine doesn’t work or it works slowly. Lack of efficacy may be due to dosage, due to the formula prescribed or the physician. Sometimes, a different Chinese medicine doctor must be consulted and/or another treatment modality engaged. Chinese medicine encompasses so many methods, including but not limited to fire needle procedures, moxibustion, herbal application through IV, acupotomy, medical qi gong, and so many other methods. Chinese medicine doctors do specialize and sometimes a specialist must also be consulted. In China, networking in this manner among Chinese medicine doctors is not uncommon. My Chinese brother, Dr. Qiu, taught me about this. Yet, the market economy and the reforms that have resulted since the 1980’s have directly affected this. Traditionally, Chinese families consulted a few Chinese medicine doctors and then decided which one they would utilize. After the market economy was introduced, however, this practice has not been so common.

With the recent 2008 World Health Organization Beijing Declaration, however, and Dr. Margaret Chan’s opening address recognizing the value of Chinese medicine as primary care and other traditional medicines as the means to treat modern illnesses, I can only imagine the global changes that will transpire. So many other countries like Indonesia look to China and its medicine as an example, as a guideline for introducing their multiple traditions to the world. Other countries like Mali also use Mali traditional medicine, western medicine and Chinese. I only hope that through more integration, more understanding and the acceptance of more traditional knowledge and techniques that more suffering would be alleviated. Isn’t that all we should wish for the global family?

http://www.who.int/dg/speeches/2008/20081107/en/index.html

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Tags: China travel, Chinese medicine, huaihua, Hunan